Peer learning is a cornerstone of Edward Lowe Foundation programs, and for two decades we have been training licensees in our PeerSpectives Roundtable System,® developed especially for second-stage entrepreneurs. During the pandemic, the foundation began to offer virtual roundtables, and in Spring 2024 we launched our first in-person roundtables in Grand Rapids and Lansing, Michigan.
Several members of the new roundtables were already familiar with the PeerSpectives system, having participated in one of our virtual roundtables. Among them is Matthew Burnell, founder of ClickBid, which provides silent auction software and fundraising services to nonprofits.
Whether it’s online or offline, spending time with peers is important for second-stage business owners, who often become isolated as their companies grow larger. “In startup days, entrepreneurs get a lot of help and support from family, friends and friends of friends,” Burnell says. “Yet once you get into second stage, you learn that your company is not your family, but your team. And that team functions very differently than a family.”
Indeed, hierarchies, structure, processes and disciplines must be implemented, which creates an enormous amount of friction with employees who have been with you since the beginning. “What’s more, some Stage 1 employees don’t fit into a growing second-stage company — and that’s really, really hard,” Burnell says.
Yet in the roundtable, Burnell finds that his load is lightened; he has an opportunity to be with like-minded people who speak the same language. “You don’t have to explain yourself,” he says. “They can laugh about your pain; you can laugh about their pain. There’s nothing like it for a CEO — being able to share the emotional wounds of starting and operating a business and not dying at the hand of your company.”
Granted, travel can sometimes be an obstacle, says Burnell, who drives 45 miles to attend the Grand Rapids roundtable. Yet even with the virtual roundtables, there is always a moment when Burnell is tempted to cancel, which he compares to the emotional struggle of getting ready for a run. “You tell yourself you don’t have time, that you don’t want to do it. But if you don’t run, you’re not going to lose weight or lower your blood pressure. Finally, you say, ‘just do it.’ Obviously, I enjoy going. It’s like a runner’s high. I don’t think anyone can say after a jog that they wished they hadn’t done that.”
Some aha moments
Like Burnell, fellow roundtable member Karen Scarpino is a huge fan of peer learning. “You can read books and listen to podcasts, but to have another biz owner, who has been in your shoes, offer their insights is a great experience,” says Scarpino, CEO of Green Giftz, a Grand Rapids-based provider of high-quality, sustainable branded merchandise.
Learning to be comfortable with vulnerability has been one of Scarpino’s takeaways. “When CEOs show up in a room, they seem like fearless creatures,” she says. “They have an aura of ‘I’ve got this,’ making it look easy to run an organization. Yet I know it isn’t.”
Scarpino recalls a fellow roundtable member who said he had to use “that four-letter word” with his team. At first, Scarpino thought he meant profanity, but it turned out that he needed to ask for “help.” Scarpino says that was a moment she’ll never forget. “As a leader, I feel responsible to always guide the team and have the vision when no one else does. When he said it’s OK to ask for help, it came at a time that was really important for me. To have that shared felt like an honor.”
For Andrew Gauthier, the roundtable was a new experience, and he admits to being on guard at first. “I’m not generally open to discussing things going on in my business,” says Gauthier, co-founder of Lansing-based Groovy Donuts. “Yet Dino did a great job of facilitating,” he says. “And the welcoming environment, due to the amazing group of entrepreneurs in the room, allowed me to quickly reach a comfort level with discussing serious concerns or room for improvement I have within my business.”
Indeed, Gauthier had been struggling with whether or not to raise prices. By talking it through with fellow roundtable members, he was able to reach a decision much more quickly — and with less angst. “It’s very hard to put a number on the value of that,” Gauthier says.
Joint retreat at Big Rock Valley
After meeting for several months, members of the two roundtables traveled to Big Rock Valley, the foundation’s 2,000-acre learning campus in southwest Michigan, for a joint retreat.*
During the three-day event, the business owners were introduced to various leadership curriculum including Shirzad Chamine’s concept of positive intelligence. “Knowing what triggers my saboteurs has really helped me understand my thinking,” Gauthier says.
Another PI fan is Deborah Horak, founder of Güd Marketing, a Lansing-based integrated marketing firm. Horak had been introduced to the PI curriculum at a prior Big Rock Valley retreat. “It made me realize how judgmental and hard I was on myself — and that I could be a better leader if I wasn’t so critical,” she says. “That was a turnaround for me. I bought the book and began to work on how I was treating myself.” At the roundtable retreat in November when Horak retook the PI assessment, her scores had improved considerably.
Horak also remarks on how quickly the two roundtable groups bonded. “The evenings at the campfire blew me away,” she says. “Even though many of us were new to each other, I was surprised how deep our conversations went.”
“I wish I had had this kind of support earlier in my career,” she adds. “The roundtable is about problem-solving with peers who get it. We’ve all gone through some painful periods of owning a business. Being able to share those ups and downs is inspiring. When you encounter a challenge, you know you’re not alone — and that you’re going to get through it.”
(Published Feb. 3, 2025)
*We want to thank our partners at the Michigan Economic Development Corp. for co-funding the joint roundtable retreat — and sponsoring participants for the next series of roundtable sessions.